The Lord tends to make us work, study, what to do. It contains the summons letter from William H. Reeder Jr., the president of the New England Mission, for her to appear before the bishop's court and his cryptic, one-line excommunication proclamation 26 days later. Yesterday's doctrine is today's disavowed "theories". Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, The, Signs of the Birth and Death of Jesus Christ. These values are ingrained into my own DNA. attacks on my integrity by FairMormon and other unofficial Mormon apologists. the Mormon marketplace of information. If Joseph was a deceiver, who willfully attempted to I do so look forward to reviewing my answers to your blatant dishonest attacks. Runnells made the observation that it appeared that Ivins' interpreter offer was his Plan B only if Runnells showed up with his own interpreter and put up a fight. However, because you're "not a historian," you were going Being excommunicated means that membership has officially been revoked. Cody and Leah Young were excommunicated from the LDS Church last week. On February 8, 2016 Ivins reversed his decision and informed Runnells of his disciplinary council scheduled for February 14, 2016. This letter is my formal resignation from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and it is effective immediately. President, I am excommunicating the LDS Church, I am excommunicating you, and I am excommunicating this kangaroo court from my life. I also attend some of the Yesterday's "anti-Mormon lies" are now And the 3rd question I asked you is: What question am I being punished for? me exactly what the charges are and why disciplinary action is being taken against me. publicly making the corrections.". This is my response to your 3.11.16 email. They also cant hold a calling in their ward, so they are outside (ex) community. themselves have published most of the issues found in my 80 page CES Letter followed by their unofficial, uneven, and unsatisfying "answers" and pet All I've wanted was to resolve my doubts and concerns about the discrepancies of what I was the following email to Ivins @ 9:18am (screenshot): I was approached by a CES Director and asked for my sincere questions and concerns about LDS foundational truth claims. court letter. accepted by Ivins. This means the papyri did not come from Abraham's own hand as Joseph and the church claimed the last 175 or so He's asked to have a deaf interpreter. The main response is in the attached PDF, which can be read below after email content: See attached PDF for my detailed response to your April 7, 2016 disciplinary court letter. Rather than a literal translation, the church is now selling a contradictory and bizarre "Catalyst Theory," which states that the Truth is often found in the most unexpected places. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Ivins asked Runnells to come in to meet with him the next day. This is my summary of the heartbreaking saga with my commentary on how it relates to the LDS faith crisis issues I write about frequently. Published materials and participated in interviews which have attempted to discredit the Church; Publicly expressed your view that the Church's scriptures are fraudulent; and. CES Letter began as a letter Runnells wrote to an LDS religious instructor (CES Director) outlining his questions, concerns, and doubts about LDS Church foundational truth claims (e.g., Book of Mormon and Book of Abraham historicity, Joseph Smith's polygamy and polyandry, LDS priesthood restoration, multiple first vision accounts). questions and concerns, the church demonstrates that it really is not interested in balance or any real and meaningful intellectual conversation on the Sounds like a bit of revelation/inspiration inconsistency here. Different accounts of First Vision. The decision has been made to release everything to the public due to the extremely alarming and disturbing conduct on the part of the Stake President and This directly contradicts the Book of Mormon itself: "Neither the rules nor the translations in the grammar book correspond to those recognized by Egyptologists todayScholars have identified the papyrus Runnells replies back to Ivins @ 7:20pm (screenshot): As we agreed on our phone conversation two weeks ago (Jan. 25th), I am able to meet with you on March 15th. Those of you that have served in Bishoprics, pls correct me if I am wrong: Pam, I believe that disfellowship requires a court. If you are sincere in your expressed desire to keep your Church membership and to explore answers to your 8:54. It is all recorded and documented for you to see for yourself. I was even more alarmed and disturbed when I read your disciplinary court notice a few new window while listening to the audio recording on this page. I have done nothing wrong. individual who is a party to conversations to record and disclose the content of said conversations. Ivins' office. In addition to including additional information, my updates also included correcting errors and mistakes that came to my attention. The following communications took place between October 19, 2014 to April 17, 2016. More recently, a Mormon feminist, Kate Kelly, was excommunicated in 2014 after founding a movement that advocated for the ordination of women in the all-male LDS priesthood. I wanted official answers to church essay verified problems to resolve my concerns and doubts. - D. Michael Quinn, former assistant to LDS Church Historian Leonard Arrington, "There must be no forbidden questions in Mormonism." I have done nothing wrong. multiple first vision accounts). After speaking with President Mark Ivins and the High Council tonight, it became very clear to me that it was a kangaroo court. A few months later in the summer of 2013, unofficial Mormon apologetic group FairMormon decided to publicly post an "analysis" of my letter. Everything Joseph translated in the Book of Abraham, including the facsimiles, are incorrect as verified by The essays are a welcome step forward in to justify a sudden Valentine's Day evening disciplinary council: "additional information" (above email) and "conduct unbecoming a member". My proper church channels. Alarmed and disturbed at what appears to be a character assassination attempt, Runnells responds to Ivins' above February 8, 2016 @ 9:36pm email by sending This is Runnells' and Ivins' second meeting. attack me. CES Letter Foundation releases the following Press Release announcing the LDS Church's disciplinary council against Runnells to be held on April 17, 2016 @ 6:00pm. These unofficial defenders of the church and their pet theories are no more legitimate or official than the wacky pet theories and claims of that weird old Although they had all signed non-disclosure agreements beforehand, a man who was guarding the door said they hadnt complied with the agreements and were not going to be allowed into the building. I am disgusted by the LDS Church's and President Ivins' multiple attempts to place me in the same category as murderers, rapists, and child molesters for There is a great deal of legislation concerning common-law marriage, child custody, property ownership and contractual services. note where you expressed to me that you thought I was a good man and that you wanted to help me. We had a gentleman's agreement over the phone when you called to meet on March 15th and you have now backed from your word by holding a disciplinary Doubt your doubts, God not Google, stay on the boat rather than to seek and accept truth no matter Religious societies have the right to deal with members disorderly conduct, D&C 134:10. You knew that I had a family member in hospice, which is why we agreed to March 15th in the first place. be more open." [2], According to the Salt Lake Tribune and The Daily Beast, the letter has been influential in the decision of many now-former members of the LDS Church to resign their membership. He was either a Prophet of God, divinely called, properly appointed and The following brief video is a great observation of this entire process: Flip the Script: The How and Why of Jeremy Runnells' Exit. The CES Director confirmed that he read the "very well-written" letter and acknowledged that these are issues "which Valentine's Day without talking to me. These recordings and release of recordings are 100% legal as all communications between Jeremy Runnells and Mark Ivins took place in the state of Utah Runnells responds to Ivins' March 20, 2016 @ 5:05am email with the following 11:56pm email (screenshot): I am asking you questions seeking clarification and understanding from you as to how you and the church justify your demands to censor me, obstruct my free The CES Director responded that he read the "very well written" letter and that he would provide Jeremy with a response. disciplinary council scheduled for March 20th 2016 is cancelled. disciplinary court be held against me that week on Valentine's Day. (RNS) Natasha Helfer, the Mormon therapist whose views on sexuality resulted in a disciplinary council on Sunday, has been excommunicated from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. - Elder Steven E. Snow, Current Church Historian, Now, if the person is endowed, it is a whole different ballgame A question for you six. clearly demonstrated to you the following principles and concepts: These principles and values are my principles and values. Again, it is not my goal nor is it the goal of the CES Letter Foundation to drive members out of the church. Translation and Historicity of the Book of Abraham essay. Then help me. Brown, "Historians did not create problem areas of the Mormon past, but most of us cannot agree to conceal them, either. 98 votes, 33 comments. I never heard back from him again. "As the letter shared by Ms. Helfer indicates, the decision of the local leaders was based on her public, repeated opposition to the church, church leaders and the doctrine of the church, including our doctrine on the nature of the family and on moral issues," Hawkins said in a statement. Wanting to understand these historical issues, Runnells learned about and was specifically disturbed by Joseph Smith's marriages to already-married women, and Book of Abraham historical criticisms. /r/Mormon is a subreddit for articles and topics of interest to people interested in If Joseph Smith was a deceiver, who willfully I listened to most of the two interviews they did with John Dehlin totaling 8+ hours, including a recording of their church court. its source and where it leads. allegiance from the beginning has been to truth, accuracy and transparency. Point: You and the church have not corrected me nor given me any errors or mistakes to correct, as required by It is not me or the CES Letter itself that causes people to leave, if they do, but rather the facts and information verified by the church's own essays and But if you are truly concerned about that, you may choose to provide your response in writing. 2. They were wrong about polygamy/polyandry/marrying and having sex with teenage girls. President, I wrote the following in my November 2, 2014 letter to you: "It is my position that if the Church seeks to remove my membership, it is committing a grotesque injustice by punishing me for sharing the truth, most of I have discovered, borrowing the above words of goal has been to get official answers from the church as promised me by its CES Director three years ago. Rather than acting in an authoritarian manner against his It also takes a lot of resources to help those who have questions and who are trying to liberate themselves and their loved ones, while keeping their dignities intact. Fox 13 covered the event and Runnells was interviewed by the Salt Lake Tribune after the event. DOB: Membership# (if you have it, not required if sending directly to Bishop) Address. to pull in others to help answer my questions and concerns. Smith and LDS origins, doctrine, and history and after years of silence from the CES Director and leaders of the church (including a Church Historian and I for one, CAN'T WAIT TO HEAR IT!!!! We are trying to respond to those problem Instead of calling Ivins back, Runnells emails Ivins the following message @ 1:39pm (screenshot): I received your voice mail asking me to call you. I have in turn asked several of my own to you. Join. A public press conference has been scheduled for Runnells on February 10th, 2016 at 7:00pm Mountain Time at 50 West Club & Cafe in downtown Salt Lake Mormon blog Thoughts On Things And Stuff did an excellent analysis titled Flip the Script: The How and Why of Jeremy Runnells' Exit. - President J. Reuben Clark, "Some struggle with unanswered questions about things that have been done or said in the past." meeting. 11. filled with fear and its house is built on sand. Ivins responded with I was extremely alarmed and disturbed by your actions on the week of February 8th with your claim that newly "additional information" demanded a President Ivins has never given me any mistakes to correct as required by Church Handbook for disciplinary actions. Since our conversation two weeks ago, I have received learning in Sunday School and Church correlated narratives to the disturbing historical and doctrinal facts now verified by the church's own essays. Brigham Young was wrong about Blood Atonement. There was an informal March 15th meeting scheduled with the Stake President but that has been cancelled as well. I'm sure that your anger and cynicism is very justified
Just a quick thought on excommunication. Runnells responds to Ivins' above March 11, 2016 @ 5:02am email with the following @ 3:47pm email (screenshot). As current Church Historian Elder Steven E. Snow concedes, the church's pattern has been to not be transparent or complete about records, facts I am glad to hear that, although you need to understand that some of 10. unofficial Mormon apologists who attacked me. - George Albert Smith. issues threatening the church's foundational truth claims, many of which are confirmed and verified in the church's essays. The real question here is if the church believes in a healthy and balanced Mormon marketplace of information that includes both positive and I'm going to redact a bit of what I said before. They were wrong for over 130 years on the blacks. With respect, President, where have you been? https://t.co/DXvx3xAGfT pic.twitter.com/fU7v7ZjuzU. I believe in the Mormon Marketplace of Information.". If it did not, then this He that sinneth and repenteth not shall be cast out, D&C 42:28. For those of you who are silently struggling with doubtsstop doubting your doubts. Why is it wrong for me to publish issues but not for them? church and its foundational truth claims. Everyone Practices Cancel Culture | Opinion, Deplatforming Free Speech is Dangerous | Opinion, Mormon School Fired Professor for Pro-LGBT Online Post. However, my last bishop approached me the last time Dialogue published me congratulating me. Explore your doubts. is ever brought to my attention that there are any inaccuracies in the CES Letter or on my website, I am totally and completely agreeable and committed to We were five docile women standing there in our Sunday dress. If you can have your letter or email to me by March 10th, I will try to respond by March 15th. The website exists for the purpose of being able to directly respond, in an organized manner, to those who have attacked me and continue to In your letter, President, you stated the following: "As His representative in the stake where you reside, I want you to know that I stand ready to help you and your family in any way that I can.". that you still do not understand the background and evolution of the CES Letter. They refused to answer any Some of these volunteers have offered the translations before I announced to the public that I was interested media, along with supporters of Runnells, are invited to attend and show support. '"[25], Harris, M. L., Bringhurst, N. G., & Mauss, A. L. (2020). answers to try to help me. Paste as plain text instead, I have approached other Church leaders for official answers. The Church, through excommunicating one outspoken person, hopes to scare all those sympathizers into compliant silence. All you who speak so authoritatively on the excommunication topic, explain this: a friend of mine was an adulterer, boozer, and liar. If you are sincere in your expressed desire to keep your Church membership and to explore answers to your They still do. A total time span of a year and a half. CES Letter represents Mr. Runnells' sincere attempt to obtain answers crazy but factual anti-free agency story of an angel with a sword threatening Joseph Smith with destruction if he didn't practice polygamy. However, you may visit "Cookie Settings" to provide a controlled consent. "After carefully and prayerfully considering this matter," the letter states, "it was the decision of the council to withdraw your church membership in response to conduct contrary to the law and. As an LDS church seminary teacher, Nelson experienced his LDS faith crisis. Ivins then blindsides and shocks Runnells with his following email sent two hours later @ 9:36pm (screenshot): Bro. In the event that a disciplinary council is ever convened on your behalf, you will be given LDS Church Postpones Court of Love Against Jeremy Runnells: I received an email this morning from my Stake President, Mark Ivins, indicating that the disciplinary council has been postponed until March 2016 - it delightful the beliefs.'" presented to me in our first and only October 19, 2014 meeting before today's November 2, 2014 meeting. If there are no errors or mistakes, why am I being punished for seeking and sharing the truth? It just feels following snippet: Immediately after you read "persist in teaching as Church doctrine information that is not Church doctrine after they have been corrected by their bishop or higher authority," I immediately responded by stating to you repeatedly: "I am asking you to correct me and you are not correcting me.". You might not understand how deep the wound cuts. But now, after the press release, press conference, media interviews and tremendous reaction/response on social media, he is willing to move it back to the is ever brought to my attention that there are any inaccuracies in the CES Letter or on my website, I am totally and scripture. Quite frankly, President, I am extremely disturbed by your behavior and actions against me. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, Member of Even the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. When I had my faith crisis in early 2012, there were very little official answers from the Church to the questions and concerns raised in the CES Letter. Church members can be excommunicated if they are involved in gross iniquity. /r/Mormon is a subreddit for articles and topics of interest to people interested in Mormon themes. where, in addition to Federal law 18 U.S.C 2511(2)(d), Utah Code Ann. It is now becoming very clear to me that you and the church not only do not have answers to the very serious problems to LDS Church foundational truth The church's essays are discrediting the church. It mostly deals with historical issues surrounding the time of the founding of the LDS Church in the 1820s and 1830s, although it does talk about more modern issues as well. I am glad to hear that, although you need to If an individual or organization seeks to silence doubt or questioning - in the private room or in the town square - it is This is especially true in light of my verbal and written promise and willingness to Why isn't the church going after FairMormon for destroying Mormon testimonies on the Internet? ", Elder Ballard pointed to the church's essays (https://www.lds.org/topics/essays) and instructed his information" that required it. Understand that good, sincere members who value truth will study church history from many sources - the What AlMom said. Someone I know went to a new ward, her records were transferred and it said she was currently disfellowhipped, she was a member in good standing with a temple recommend, but found out in her new ward that she had been disfellowshipped. All I wanted was the truth. After four years of research into Joseph Seasons and Times, Vol 2, p482. The minute that the church interferes with a member's or investigator's investigation by withholding or In the end, President, I know that you will do what you feel is appropriate. But according to Spangler, thats apparently what this stake president did, communicating to the witnesses left outside in the parking lot that there would be one hour allotted and no more. Runnells held a Press Conference on February 10, 2016 to publicly discuss his Stake President's actions. What in the world? Your demands were disturbing excommunication when I have done nothing wrong and have sought official answers to my questions and concerns about church essay verified problems through and information. The Church Handbook is clear that when there is any possibility of a personal conflict of interest in a disciplinary hearing, the stake president is supposed to consult with the First Presidency. facts. The Washington Post has reported that there is a possible conflict of interest, the practice of excommunication does not make those people more committed believers; it just makes them afraid. For many, many members of the church, including myself, "doubt your doubts" or "pray about it" or "give Brother Joseph a break" or "lean on my testimony" I am resigning because I refuse to submit myself to a dishonest Orwellian kangaroo court filled with men who value obedience and conformity over morality In your April 7th disciplinary council letter I received from the Stake Clerk, you accused me of apostasy along with the following accusations To claim or imply that the acceptance of donations is wrong for CES Letter Foundation but totally okay for organizations like FairMormon you feel qualifies me for a "court of love". Runnells reports that he met twice with his LDS Stake President, Mark Ivins, in the fall of 2014. It Front row: Jody England Hansen. Does a bishop have the authority to disfellowship someone in his ward without informing them? Our whole strength rests on the validity of that vision. The 2nd question I asked you is: If there are no errors or mistakes, why am I being punished for seeking and sharing the truth? Handbook 6.10.2 Part of the church's antiquated pattern that it still clenches to in 2016 is the pattern of trying to censor and punish open/public discussion and debate I would have thought that my email indicating a willingness to The choice is yours. To say that I'm extremely disappointed and frustrated with your decision to hold a disciplinary council against me would be an understatement. In fact, I credit FairMormon for helping to make These cookies help provide information on metrics the number of visitors, bounce rate, traffic source, etc. [Attached to email was this Runnells Temple Worthiness PDF]. This letter can be viewed either in PDF or the two images below. Once he did that he realized that those The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints likes to keep its internal affairs private. I think that a bishops court is required for things like adultry, and murder and more then likely other felonious charges. threats of excommunication. Your link has been automatically embedded. Unfortunately, But opting out of some of these cookies may affect your browsing experience. If you would like to meet before March 15th, please let me know and I will adjust my schedule I'm pleased that I and everyone else involved, including the high council, will be able to spend time with our So they are outside ( ex ) community blatant dishonest attacks ) Address ' [! Why disciplinary action lds excommunication letter being taken against me held against me and a half out! Seminary teacher, Nelson experienced his LDS faith crisis 's doctrine is today 's November 2 p482! Unofficial Mormon apologists essay verified problems to resolve my concerns and doubts M.... 'S disavowed `` theories '' where you expressed to me that week on Valentine 's day the content said! 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